Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

by Garry Kilworth

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Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby Liz » Sun Sep 13, 2009 10:29 am

Pg. 137:

‘I’m not like you, Clo. I see this place differently. To me Ben and Dipa are just under the floorboards. I like this place. I’m having this adventure up here, above their heads, and they’re down below, content to wait for me to come back. Maybe they are, Clo? You can’t say they’re not.’

Let’s discuss how men and women can view things differently and how that is illustrated in the story.
You can't judge a book by its cover.

The only thing that matters is the ending. It's the most important part of the story.

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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby trygirl » Sun Sep 13, 2009 11:03 am

I think men are content to see the road ahead but women are conditioned to view all the little outskirts. Men deal with the what's around them, things seen and tangible. I guess they're not cautious by nature and women are better at looking at situations from many angles, examining things happening and things yet to happen. For young Alex, his parents are where he left them, all he needs to do in order to be with them again, is come down from the attic. And I don't think Jordy quite understands their predicament the same way as Chloe either. He may recognize the feeling to get out of Attica but he can't sense the danger closing in around them like Chloe. She's aware the longer they spend in the attic, the further they get from home. And while all of this is a generalization of men/boys, I think women are just better at preparing themselves for the real journeys of the future. Men live in the now and women don't risk it. Chloe even says as much, when she wisely says, "men need mothers their whole lives," or something like these words. Another great example of how men and women are different is with Mr. Grantham and the watch. Chloe wants to find the lost object and symbolically reunite old lovers and for the boys it's treasure.
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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby DeppInTheHeartOfTexas » Sun Sep 13, 2009 2:06 pm

I like your answer trygirl! :cool: Women are better multi-taskers and as you say more forward looking. Maybe because they are generally the nurturers of the group and feel responsible for many at one time, the herders as Garry mentioned about Chloe. I think the boys, while still thinking about home, are seeing the adventure of the moment.
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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby ladylinn » Sun Sep 13, 2009 2:44 pm

I believe that girls/women have more of a nurturing side than boys/men. The male is more ready to take a leap into unknown areas without fear, while the female will make that leap with one foot still on the beginning point. Of course I am from the "old school" - but I see in my granddaughters that they are much braver about their future and ready to go in any direction to achieve their goals. But still the ties to home are still important to both girls/women and boys/men. That is family!

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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby deppaura » Sun Sep 13, 2009 5:16 pm

If so inclined, women are the nesters, keepers of the brood. And, supposedly see the Big Picture. It seems to be part of the plan. And, also may have to do basically with hormones?? The plan seems to give us each a particular purpose. Of course, there is often a crossover of these characteristics, male to female and vice versa. That's what makes life interesting Today there are many who will argue these concepts. The ego and intellect seem to challenge what IS. I thought the children displayed moments of a combination of traits. Amanda is amazingly savvy about the world of Attica. She was captain of the ship in her sailing skills. Chloe musters the courage to fly the glider. Alex allows his deeper. softer side to emerge regarding the grief he carried. They represented todays kids exposed to a more balanced male/female world. Somehow they seemed like new world kids exploring the "old" world of Attica. Maybe I saw the ability to "crossover" more prevalent in the girls? I found Chloe to be particularly brave in her circumstances. I would have been pretty scared most of the time!!

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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby fansmom » Sun Sep 13, 2009 6:17 pm

deppaura wrote:And, also may have to do basically with hormones??
Funny that I would come home to read this after a walk during which I heard about this on the radio--

It doesn’t take a PhD in psychology or social psychology to know that men in general are bigger risk takers than women. . . new research from Northwestern University and the University of Chicago showing that gender and testosterone make a difference in financial risk aversion . . .

Well, gotta go. Benny and Joon is on TV. "Wait," you ask, "don't you own it on DVD?" Yes, of course. What's your point?
Last edited by fansmom on Sun Sep 13, 2009 11:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby nebraska » Sun Sep 13, 2009 6:25 pm

Oops. I thought I answered this earlier, but I must not have followed through...:perplexed:

I think you all have been giving good answers. I am "old school" as well -- don't you let me get on my soap box! I see a lot of good things happening, I think it is wonderful that more fathers are hands-on parents, for instance. That seems so much better for the children, to have two parents involved with their care.

But I do think there are hormonal and structural influences that will always keep men and women on different wave lengths. I just don't think the male brain is hardwired for any sort of multi-tasking.

At our recent family gathering I was explaining to my brother in law how to make room in my freezer for his container of homemade ice cream, and when I got beyond two items of instruction, I could see his eyes glaze over. :lol: His wife chipped in and said she would go with him and "they" could take care of it.

Maybe the man's intense focus on one thing at a time and a woman's ability to multitask goes way back to our hunting and gathering cave days.

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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby gemini » Sun Sep 13, 2009 8:03 pm

I think in general the nesting instinct keeps women more adverse to risk than men and more cautious. Sometimes I think it may work in reverse though when you think of a mother protecting her young. There isn't anything more fierce.

I did find this comment in the link fansmom provided about testosterone very interesting even though the article showed men more risk takers because of testosterone
However, in men and women with similar levels of testosterone, the gender difference in risk aversion disappeared.
This sentence sort of says it's more the hormone than the sex of the person.

The children in the book, although all the males leaned toward adventure and risk taking, showed that the girls possessed many of the same traits. Chloe while just as protective of her brothers as they were of her, was not afraid of venturing into the attic even after she saw there was risk. Amanda was as fierce a fighter as any male but she was protecting her nest.

The book is one thing, but in real life I see many of your points about old school but I have come to think much of it is how we are raised. Males will always be the same but in the younger generation of girls, many are much more adventurous and risk takers then past generations.
Back to the original question, I do agree with what has been said about multitasking and the way we view things. There is certainly a difference in the sexes. Whether its in the hormones or just the genes, its there.
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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby DeppInTheHeartOfTexas » Sun Sep 13, 2009 9:06 pm

There was a comedy show written by Rob Becker back in the 1980's called Defending the Caveman. It is intensely funny and at times very insightful in the differences between men and women. Basically he says that women are gatherers and therefore have a greater ability to take in many things around them on many levels while men are hunters, focused on the objective.

I do agree that the ability of the younger generation (younger than me!) to see that some gender role lines can be crossed without concern, in fact as a matter of course, is wonderful. Having grown up in the generation of women are nurses and men are doctors, and now seeing young women who think nothing of becoming whatever they want, gender not being a consideration, I'm thrilled!

However, vive la difference!
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming -

Wow! What a ride!

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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby fansmom » Sun Sep 13, 2009 10:36 pm

DeppInTheHeartOfTexas wrote:Having grown up in the generation of women are nurses and men are doctors
When my daughter was about five years old, she seriously told me that doctors are men and nurses are women.
"What does Uncle Paul do?" I asked. (My brother.)
"Oh. He's a nurse."
"And Gail?" (My college roommate.)
"Oh. She's a doctor." (Light began to dawn.)
"And who do we take you to for your checkups?"
"Oh. Mrs. Pignatero. I guess that nurses and doctors can be girls or boys."
"Right, sweetie."

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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby Garry » Mon Sep 14, 2009 7:01 am

Heck, I can't keep up with you guys, you have written almost a novel length while I'm sleeping. I'll have to read all the posts when I get home and have the time to browse, there's far too many here. (I'm supposed to be out looking at Viking ship burials!) I just thought I'd address the issue of Marmite, which came up earlier. Marmite is a British institution (Australians have it too, but they call it Vegemite). My generation grew up with it from birth, along with another British institution 'brown sauce'. The newest generation here now is not so keen on Marmite as we were, but definitely prefers ketchup to brown sauce on their fish and chips. (You Americans, your influence spreads. I never saw ketchup as a young boy.) Anyway, Marmite is indeed an acquired taste. Not every kid here likes it of course, and those that hate it really hate it.

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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby Liz » Mon Sep 14, 2009 11:02 am

Brown sauce? Does it have curry in it? (just kidding, DITHOT :grin:) I asked my DH if he knew what either marmite or brown sauce was (he lived in Carterton, UK between the ages of 9 and 13). He doesn’t remember.

Here’s the FAQ on Brown Sauce from another interesting website that knows how to do tidbits:



And yes, Garry, our Noodlemantras seem to have had a lot to say on the difference between men and women. I was away from the computer all day yesterday at a family gathering and have some catching up to do myself.

Enjoy your tour of viking ship burials today.
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The only thing that matters is the ending. It's the most important part of the story.

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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby Liz » Mon Sep 14, 2009 12:44 pm

I agree with what everyone has said about women and nesting, herding, multi-tasking, etc. They also tend to be more sensitive to the feelings of others and worry about how their actions will affect them. Although this is a generality, I do see these tendencies displayed in Chloe but not in Alex. Alex didn’t seem to be concerned about how worried his mom would be. That was just not a concern of his. And I was angry with him for being so selfish. On the other hand, he seemed to sense that time had stopped before he even knew it had, which could have contributed to his lack of concern. I had not anticipated that at that juncture in the book.

Ladylinn, I do notice that as the years go by the differences between men and women become fewer. And deppaura, I totally agree with your “crossover” point. But, like you, I think it was more prevalent in Chloe & Amanda than in the boys. Fansmom, considering your history of Twilight Zone moments, I can’t say that I’m surprised at the timing of your happening upon that bit of info. And it is interesting, indeed. In my own case, I see a combination of traditional tendencies existing in my own kids. This might be due to how my kids were raised (as gemini pointed out). And I’m not sure it was due to modeling as it was due to reacting and learning to live in our familial environment or something innately in them that was nurtured by the parent of the opposite sex.


nebraska wrote:Maybe the man's intense focus on one thing at a time and a woman's ability to multitask goes way back to our hunting and gathering cave days.

It could be as simple as that. :biggrin:(I love this new little emotiguy)

But I found this quote interesting too....

However, in men and women with similar levels of testosterone, the gender difference in risk aversion disappeared.
You can't judge a book by its cover.

The only thing that matters is the ending. It's the most important part of the story.

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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby fansmom » Mon Sep 14, 2009 8:13 pm

I will probably be pelted with things by UK Zoners for saying this, but the taste of brown sauce reminds me of Lea & Perrins Worcestershire Sauce, although brown sauce is slightly thicker.

(And I can get back to Johnny from brown sauce in one step--I remember trying brown sauce on chips in a pub near the Tower of London, while waiting for a Jack the Ripper tour to start--the same tour Johnny did before "From Hell." ;-) )

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Re: Attica Question #6 ~ Boys and Girls/Men and Women

Unread postby Gilbert's Girl » Tue Sep 15, 2009 2:08 am

Liz wrote:Brown sauce? Does it have curry in it? (just kidding, DITHOT :grin:) I asked my DH if he knew what either marmite or brown sauce was (he lived in Carterton, UK between the ages of 9 and 13). He doesn’t remember.

Here’s the FAQ on Brown Sauce from another interesting website that knows how to do tidbits:



And yes, Garry, our Noodlemantras seem to have had a lot to say on the difference between men and women. I was away from the computer all day yesterday at a family gathering and have some catching up to do myself.

Enjoy your tour of viking ship burials today.


Brown sauce :yuck:
Carterton? Really? Not that far from here :ok:

Interestingly they did an experiment on one of the tv shows the other day showing the difference between men and women. The one I watched was the differences about what men and women listen to and take in. They sat in a cab and listened to the cabby tell two stories one about an old car and one about his marriage. Bet you can guess the results :lol:


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