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Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 3:36 pm
by Liz
dharma_bum wrote:I loved suec’s thoughts on overcoming paralysis in a crisis by making decisions, but I agree with Nebraska that I found ALWD’s intervention a contrived piece of writing.

Does anyone remember Ordinary People, either the book or movie? Jess’ character arc is so similar: Parent’s lose the child everyone loves and punish the more complicated child for simply being the one to survive. Complicated child overcomes suicidal thoughts with this epiphany in therapy.

I think remembering OP made the intervention in ALWD seem more counterfeit.


I think this is a common storyline--not necessarily the suicidal aspect--but parents punishing the child left behind. In fact, there is a movie out right now with that storyline. It's a true story, though. :-O

Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 5:30 pm
by DeppLovesBananahs
I think it was a good idea because it made everyone open with eachother, something that wouldn't have happened otherwise. I have to say I was touched by Jess's mom who once she spoke with Maureen, dropped the whole "earrings" thing. JJ's intervention was interesting too, because you sort of found out Lizzie's side of things, and Ed's take on the band's breakup and such. I liked the homeless guy too, it was good to have a referee so to speak. He was like, hit him. And then, Lizzie said kiss him, and all, that made me chuckle.


All in all, the intervention scored Jess some points, I thought it was good to organize something like this, because all of them at this point were still lost. They needed to talk to loved ones and friends and this gave them that opportunity. I agree that she didn't think it through, but still it had to happen at least it worked out, somewhat.

I have a question though, about Martin's bit with the wheelchair, why exactly was he so jealous of that guy? I know he was angered when Penny was sitting with Steve was it....? But it wasn't clear, it was almost like he went crazy.


Hannah

Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 8:12 pm
by DeppInTheHeartOfTexas
Hannah, I just went back and read that part with Martin at the intervention (pg. 284). What I took away from it this time as an answer to your question is this passage by Martin, "I was, in retrospect, almost certainly looking for an excuse to leave the bosom of my family..." So I guess he was trying to drive his family further away, maybe as further punishment to himself? Other ideas?

Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 8:15 pm
by DeppInTheHeartOfTexas
fansmom wrote: I'd say it wasn't a good idea, because Jess never thought things through. It worked out better than it had any right to.

Maybe part of the problem was that she was a product of her age, and thought life should be neatly wrapped up in TV show or movie length packages.


You are quite right about that, fansmom... it did work out better than it had a right to! One of the characters, I think it was Martin makes the comment that it must have been because of her age. That she was used to happy endings from watching TV, etc., and she thought she could make it happen for them.

Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 8:35 pm
by Liz
DeppInTheHeartOfTexas wrote:Hannah, I just went back and read that part with Martin at the intervention (pg. 284). What I took away from it this time as an answer to your question is this passage by Martin, "I was, in retrospect, almost certainly looking for an excuse to leave the bosom of my family..." So I guess he was trying to drive his family further away, maybe as further punishment to himself? Other ideas?


But prior to that he also said on pg. 283 that "Jealousy is likely to seize a man at any time". So I'm thinking it's just a self-confidence issue. And Martin certainly suffers from lack of self-confidence as a man. I believe that is why he thought of suicide.

Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 8:44 pm
by DeppInTheHeartOfTexas
Very true! And I think he was jealous of the nurse not just because Penny was giving him attention but because the guy had is all going for him -- youth, looks, a decent job and as far as Martin knew, no bad reputation to fight.

Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2005 10:10 pm
by DeppLovesBananahs
DeppInTheHeartOfTexas wrote:Hannah, I just went back and read that part with Martin at the intervention (pg. 284). What I took away from it this time as an answer to your question is this passage by Martin, "I was, in retrospect, almost certainly looking for an excuse to leave the bosom of my family..." So I guess he was trying to drive his family further away, maybe as further punishment to himself? Other ideas?


So, it was a combination of jealousy and driving his family away? It seemed like an impulsive move, like a bunch of emotions leading to him acting that way.

Thank you for helpin' me out! I lent my book to my friend, so I didn't have it to look over. Thanks for your help.

Hannah

P.S. I must PM you, DITHOT, I know I can't post anything about not Johnny-related books, but I have another book we're starting in English. It's called Bridge over San Rey(Not sure if that last word is spelled right.) --Hannah--