TL Question #13 ~ The Message

by Stephen Jeffreys

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DeppInTheHeartOfTexas
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TL Question #13 ~ The Message

Unread postby DeppInTheHeartOfTexas » Sat Dec 17, 2005 11:23 am

Do you think there is a message behind the play as opposed to just a story based on a rake from the 17th century?
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming -
Wow! What a ride!

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Gilbert's Girl
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Unread postby Gilbert's Girl » Sat Dec 17, 2005 11:44 am

to me its just an interesting play based on Rochester, but I'm awfully bad at looking for messages :lol:

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Unread postby Jackslady » Sat Dec 17, 2005 12:19 pm

I think much like Rochester, Jeffries leaves us to make up our own minds. Worthless rake or genius? Sinner or convert? A life lived to the full, pushing everything to the limits and relished, or a life wasted?

I like it that we are left with questions, both about Rochester and the play.
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Unread postby Betty Sue » Sat Dec 17, 2005 12:34 pm

Good answers! I don't know what Jeffreys had in mind, but he certainly wrote a fascinating story about a fascinating guy. I'm sure that anyone who likes to get messages from stories can find plenty in this play, just as one could from studying almost anyone's life. Maybe someone leading a very selfish life would think twice about it after reading this...?
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Unread postby lumineuse » Sat Dec 17, 2005 12:36 pm

Wow - that's a tough question. I'm going to have to ponder that one. I think you can take all kinds of lessons from Rochester's life, but whether or not the play has a message is a different matter.
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Liz
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Unread postby Liz » Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:05 pm

lumineuse wrote:Wow - that's a tough question. I'm going to have to ponder that one. I think you can take all kinds of lessons from Rochester's life, but whether or not the play has a message is a different matter.


They are two entirely different matters.
You can't judge a book by its cover.

The only thing that matters is the ending. It's the most important part of the story.

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Unread postby luvdepp » Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:24 pm

Jackslady wrote:I think much like Rochester, Jeffries leaves us to make up our own minds. Worthless rake or genius? Sinner or convert? A life lived to the full, pushing everything to the limits and relished, or a life wasted?

I like it that we are left with questions, both about Rochester and the play.

I would like to think that Rochester was all of those things, good and bad. I don't think anyone is completely good or evil, but has both qualities within them. It is just how they choose to live their life, which shows one side more than the other. I think Rochester left a legacy of beautiful words for us, but on the other hand, he treated the people around him with little regard or kindness. I think Jeffreys was trying to show that the Earl was a conflicted and complicated man, who had genius within him but chose to waste a good portion of his life with the choices he made. I suppose that there is a message in that.
"So we shall let the reader answer this question for himself, who is the happier man, he who has braved the storm of life and lived or he who has stayed securely on the shore and merely existed." ~HST~

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Unread postby dharma_bum » Sat Dec 17, 2005 3:04 pm

I came across this quote out of context a few years ago:
“I’ll take ambition over genius any day of the week”… Jay Leno

I think The Libertine makes the case for the need for genius in the world. I think most people do cast their lot with the “urgent nows” of ambition rather than with the challenge of “why should I?” As a result a great many people live content, but unexamined lives. It has always been the dissident voices and subversive thinkers among us that have driven the controversy, passion and debate that has ultimately evolved human experience.

JW squandered his own genius in his quest for truth, but in the process, unlocked great gifts in others that he could not unlock in himself. He lived an authentic life; albeit not a safe, secure or content one.
"You can't broom out your head. You certainly can't broom out your heart. And there's a hot wire between them, and everything shows in the eyes."
—Johnny Depp

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Liz
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Unread postby Liz » Sat Dec 17, 2005 3:15 pm

dharma_bum wrote:JW squandered his own genius in his quest for truth, but in the process, unlocked great gifts in others that he could not unlock in himself. He lived an authentic life; albeit not a safe, secure or content one.


I like that, Dharma.

And for anyone who missed the thread on the T-shirt with that quote on it started by Sandstorm, I want to point out this link:


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7572607808&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1
You can't judge a book by its cover.

The only thing that matters is the ending. It's the most important part of the story.

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Re: TL Question #13 ~

Unread postby Larkwoodgirl » Sat Dec 17, 2005 3:57 pm

DeppInTheHeartOfTexas wrote:Do you think there is a message behind the play as opposed to just a story based on a rake from the 17th century?


I think the message (if it indeed has one) is that Rochester had all the privileges that an aristocratic life could provide, he had astounding intellectual insight, and the gifts of a true artist. He had it all. However, in the end, Rochester was equally as mortal and flawed as the people he despised and denounced.

I think that it makes a statement about how truly easy it is to lose your way and become the very things that you loathe and despise.
""We shall never cease from exploration and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time." T.S. Eliot

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DeppInTheHeartOfTexas
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Unread postby DeppInTheHeartOfTexas » Sat Dec 17, 2005 7:34 pm

Interesting replies, everyone. I took away what many of you did - the dichotomy that was JW, his search for purity and truth, that one should examine what is around them and try to live YOUR life fully and of course as a cautionary tale.
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming -

Wow! What a ride!

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Unread postby gilly » Sun Dec 18, 2005 2:31 am

I see messages and meanings everywhere :grin: But I'm not sure I can see a message in this play.....There are many messages to be taken from Rochester's life..but that doesn't seem to come through strongly here,which is a bit strange...I guess the main meaning of the play is meant to be repentance and redemption..but the messages are mixed there too...So I'm a little confused..or maybe I need to go back and read the play again. :baby:
Life is beautiful.

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Liz
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Unread postby Liz » Sun Dec 18, 2005 3:06 am

Gilly, there are mixed and many messages, although I think in the end it is about repentance and redemption. But I've come to the conclusion that it is up to the individual to get out of it what she will because there are so many possibilities.
You can't judge a book by its cover.

The only thing that matters is the ending. It's the most important part of the story.

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karla
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Unread postby karla » Sun Dec 18, 2005 9:09 am

Liz wrote:
lumineuse wrote:Wow - that's a tough question. I'm going to have to ponder that one. I think you can take all kinds of lessons from Rochester's life, but whether or not the play has a message is a different matter.


They are two entirely different matters.


I agree that they are two entirely different matters. I could go on for days on meanings in Wilmots life.

On the play though I think it is an interesting snapshot of a very interesting character in a very interesting time. It has the elements of a good play - tragedy and comedy. It opens many questions and leaves them unanswered. I think seen on stage it would be very dramatic.

It would be great to see JD and JM do this on the stage!

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Unread postby DeppInTheHeartOfTexas » Sun Dec 18, 2005 11:11 am

karla wrote: It would be great to see JD and JM do this on the stage!


That would be great! :cool:
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming -

Wow! What a ride!


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